When the real world and D&D magic collide.

[roseembolism]

In a recent discussion thread the question was brought up: visualize a modern world where D&D magic was developed in the middle ages. After considering what D&D magic is capable of, my personal view is that it would resemble nothing like either our world or the standard D&D world. For example, consider the effects of:


1431: Roun France
Joan of Arc: "You. Are going to burn. Me. Me. Do you want fire? Here's some fire- FIRE STORM! And while we're at it (summon) Talk to the Arcon about God and heresy."

(High level clerical spells and summonings could easily start, or end a crusade, and have really strange effects on religion.)


1512: Italy
Machiavelli: (hand gesture) "You will stop supporting the Medici's attack against Florence."
Pope Julius II: "I will stop supporting the Medici's attack against Florence."
Machiavelli: (hand gesture) "You will appoint me as your personal adviser."
Pope Julius II: "I will appoint you as my personal adviser."

(The effects of Dominate, Charm Person and similar spells can't be understated in completely warping he political state of the world. Just consider how many events in history could have been changed if a single ruler had decided other than he did.)


1540; Germany
Martin Luthor: "How DARE the Papists monopolize Healing Altars and Hero's Feasts for the wealthy! My Healing Altars and Hero's Feast Altars will serve everyone for free!"

(The ability to create magical devices will have the greatest effect on the world. It's possible in 3.X to create immobile chargeless at-will devices for spells up to True Resurrection. Sure they would be expensive, but the ability to bring back any deceased with no ill effect would massively change warfare, and the costs could be amortized over thousands of people. Similar devices for curing diseases could render plagues irrelevant, and at-will Heroes' Feasts devices could render most agriculture redundant.)


1505: Florence
Leonardo de Vinci: "And so we see by guiding the stream of water from the Decanter of Endless Water against the vanes of the screw, we have a source of motive power for pumps, cranes, carriages and an endless assortment of other devices. In fact, I am now working on a self-propelled balloon which will..."

(I've mentioned before that medieval and Renaissance engineers were very talented and ingenious in their own right, and their main limitations in construction were materials and power. Magic eliminates those restraints. Spells like Fabrication and Wall of Stone could revolutionize construction and engineering.)


In other words, very shortly the world will look nothing at all like history. We're talking about a Renaissance Singularity where the major limitations of the era are eliminated, and the political landscape subject to shifting at the whim of people with the right spells. And I think that considering what powerful magic could do to change pre-industrial Europe may be useful in thinking about creating unique fantasy worlds, and making them look more unique than a faux-medieval Europe.

So does anyone have any ideas of what bizarre things do you think could come out of a D&D/Historical Renaissance?

Comments

[chaos-israel.livejournal.com]

>at-will Heroes' Feasts devices could render most agriculture redundant

That right there is effectively The Singularity.

Does 3.X still have the Minor Creation/Major Creation spells that allow you to conjure up simple inexpensive items out of thin air? Items with those spells would effectively be replicators.

Greater Teleport: "Distance is not a factor."^[1] So the 12 guys who have been on the Moon? Could go back any time they wanted to. Depending on the number of people they could teleport with them, we could have a permanent colony on the Moon by now.


^[1](I think Einstein's head just exploded.)

[mithriltabby]

As soon as the existence of charm spells were known, every ruler would have magical bodyguards to deal with them. All those crowns and miters and vestments would be heavily enchanted with protective spells. And you wouldn’t have schisms like the Reformation in the first place: you can cast Commune and find out about issues directly. The availability of healing magic and longevity potions to royalty would do many weird things to dynasties. Armies would march with specialists focusing on spell defense. And you could get really interesting disputes if using weather magic to avoid droughts or floods in one place causes them in another— whole wars could break out over that.

Your main bottleneck is availability of people to wield magic. You won’t get a Singularity because the positive feedback loop damps out: as soon as all available people with the talent for magic have been trained, your society is saturated. Enchantment usually requires a lot of time from highly trained people, as well as valuable materials, so I doubt you’d see ubiquitous items replicating food and goods for the peasantry, or enchanted labor-saving devices for the middle class. Make your Cure-Disease-at-will item an enchanted arch that casts Cure Disease on everyone walking in your city’s gates, and put those in major cities on trade routes as firewalls for plagues. You don’t need very many bound water elementals to create pumping stations for your city’s water supply.

[heron61.livejournal.com]

I'd expect permanent teleport circles between all major cities within 20 years of magic becoming known. In a century, there would be ultrawealthy people with a house which consisted of separate rooms connected by permanent teleport circles - instead of a refrigerator, part of the pantry would be a room surrounded by an alpine glacier, and there would be several main living areas, one for each season of the year -a warm but not too hot Summer in the French room, a cozy Winter room in the southern portions of Italy or Spain... If magic became known and reliable around 1,200 CE, the world would be very strange and magical place by 1,400 CE, and I don't think anyone can predict what 2,010 would look like - I'm guessing that by 1,600 at the latest the entire planet would be a drastically post singularity society where immortals dwelled in floating cities and elementals and other summoned beings & constructs waited on their every need. I'd expect upgrading people, body switching and suchlike to come in eventually. Also, by no later than 1,300 the great age of planar exploration would start (if the planes existed). Even if other planes don't exist, good telescopes to sight enhancing magic + greater teleport = interplanetary travel.

Depending upon the various events and the quirks of history, 1,600 could look like anything from Star Trek to Eclipse Phase (with magic instead of tech), but it wouldn't look like either D&D or our world.

Edit: I also just remembered the 5th level Druid spell Awaken - permanently give any plant or animal human intelligence. I would presume that it would breed true if two Awakened animals mated. I'd imagine that this would have a significant affect on the world.

[mrteufel.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry to be picky, but I had to read it twice before I understood what you were saying... so:

"Altar" not "Alter" please. The first is a table of worship, the second is a verb meaning "modify".

[seawasp]

This is trivially obvious. And yet I have had people -- otherwise quite sensible, intelligent people -- seriously argue that if D&D magic worked it would NOT have changed the middle ages appreciably -- because people already believed it worked, and therefore they'd still behave the same.

If you assume magic worked all along, nothing we know in history would be the same.

Basically, at whatever point you assume useful, reliable magic enters the world, at that point the world is changed.

Exactly HOW it's changed is determined by what you allow magic to do and what limitations -- tactical, strategic, etc. -- it has.

[fintach.livejournal.com]

To really suss out the effects, you have to first decide where and how it develops. That will determine how the knowledge and power is distributed, controlled, and directed.